tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21749731.post7031782486512520281..comments2023-10-12T10:09:54.121-04:00Comments on Believing is Knowing: Some Thoughts About Tzara'atDavid Guttmannhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07668302013143561290noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21749731.post-20193827388230694692012-05-15T06:39:44.993-04:002012-05-15T06:39:44.993-04:00There is a significant difference in the stage of ...There is a significant difference in the stage of Teshuva each mitzva is instrumental to. <br /><br />Tzaraat facilitates hakarat ha-cheyt, the resistance to the intuition that one is choteh can be distorted by the imagination into physical symptoms or mystical notions about the environment. Tzaraat channels this conflict toward resolution in a coherent self reflection.<br /><br />The Nazir has already translated his intuition into a clear judgement that he is in cheyt. His miztva is in the area of preparation for final viduy and its implementation.Rabbi Jonathan Sackshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06724954433302279666noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21749731.post-31791989055884523402012-05-14T19:14:20.257-04:002012-05-14T19:14:20.257-04:00yes.It is interesting because it reminds us of a N...yes.It is interesting because it reminds us of a Nazir who is a choteh unless he does it as self improvement. Here too there is a teshuvah process in a certain sense.David Guttmannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07668302013143561290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21749731.post-47636393689278481162012-05-13T16:56:18.115-04:002012-05-13T16:56:18.115-04:00יג [י] הצרעת--הוא שם האמור בשותפות, כולל עניינים ...יג [י] הצרעת--הוא שם האמור בשותפות, כולל עניינים הרבה שאין דומין זה לזה: שהרי לובן<br /> עור האדם, קרוי צרעת; ונפילת מקצת שיער הראש או הזקן, קרוי צרעת; ושינוי עין הבגדים או הבתים, קרוי צרעת. וזה השינוי האמור בבגדים ובבתים שקראה אותו תורה צרעת בשותפות השם--אינו ממנהגו של עולם, אלא אות ופלא היה בישראל כדי להזהירן מלשון הרע.<br /><br />At first blush it seems that the tzaraat of the skin, being a human phenomenon, is subject to psychosomatic disease. It seems that such tzaraat is miminhago shel olam. Alternatively, it might be Hashgacha.<br /><br />However the tzaraat of the clothes and house,being material objects without the unique tzelem of man, that is not miminhago shel olam but rather an ot and mofet in the perception of man.<br /><br />Is this your reading?Rabbi Jonathan Sackshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06724954433302279666noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21749731.post-18517465560916220992012-05-06T18:17:58.483-04:002012-05-06T18:17:58.483-04:00ממנהגו של עולם is illness. Tzara'at is therefo...ממנהגו של עולם is illness. Tzara'at is therefore not ממנהגו של עולם.<br />אות ופלא is in the eyes of the beholder not intrinsic to the phenomenon.<br />A discoloration is seen by the eyes of one with the proper attitude of one who repents from lashon hara as אות ופלא .David Guttmannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07668302013143561290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21749731.post-69236442306059545412012-05-06T17:56:47.856-04:002012-05-06T17:56:47.856-04:00If that is the case -then what is the difference b...If that is the case -then what is the difference between אות ופלא and ממנהגו של עולם ? It sounds, according to you, both are expressions of the laws of natural.Pinny Rosenthalnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21749731.post-33756906914845271482012-05-06T10:16:03.255-04:002012-05-06T10:16:03.255-04:00Pinny, the question is what אות ופלא mean and also...Pinny, the question is what אות ופלא mean and also in the context. Rambam in Pirush Hamishna clearly sees it as a non-medical discoloration of the skin. These are quite common and I would have a hard time classifying that as "miraculous". Similarly in the houses and clothes he notes that these are non-biological and therefore these discolorations are not some kind of disease. I would have a hard time seeing a reddish or green discoloration (possibly a mold) as a miraculous event. I believe the Torah is asking us to interpret a natural event as an impetus for introspection. I have still not found any strong statement in chazal that this is more than a voluntary reporting. I did find one but that was only after Hesger where there is an obligation to report back.<br /><br />As I said this is all tentative and would feel much more comfortable if I found any such discussion among Rishonim unless it was obvious to them.David Guttmannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07668302013143561290noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21749731.post-88691931666727813882012-05-06T09:54:02.031-04:002012-05-06T09:54:02.031-04:00Dear David,
You wrote -
"Rambam points out ...Dear David, <br />You wrote - <br />"Rambam points out that Tzara’at does not stand for a specific disease but is rather a generalization of various occurrences that are not biological illnesses - ממנהגו של עולם – but rather are seen by Jews as - אות ופלא – signs and markers of improper behavior.<br /><br />I come away from all this with the impression that Tzara’at is a Halachik construct used to make us aware of the damages uncontrolled gossip can cause. There is no intrinsic disease, just a tool to use for self-improvement. A person, who has a problem with uncontrolled gossip and wants to change, will use Tzara’at as a tool to work on himself through temporary isolation and distancing from society allowing for proper introspection on his own bad behavior and work on overcoming it."<br /><br />Is not the change of skin color, on clothing, garments and the home - a miraculous physical change?Pinny Rosenthalnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21749731.post-43471080505243405212012-05-02T21:44:33.831-04:002012-05-02T21:44:33.831-04:00Rav Hirsch relates Tzaria to tumah and looks at it...Rav Hirsch relates Tzaria to tumah and looks at it as a spiritual state of despair.jonathangenkinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08323085674694569565noreply@blogger.com